Whoever took everyone emails without asking need to
read "producing open source software" from karl
Fogel(one of the guy that wrote Subversion, and many
more good software).
This will give you some very big good hint on mailing
list : Things you should do or not, things you should
tell or not..
You have just stepped in all the "do not".
Swearing and insulting people is definitely something
that is not ok. Because you might be thousand miles
away behing a computer does not make it ok and make
you feel safe. So avoid this type of comments will be
better for everyone in the community
You made a mistake, and it can happen. But you should
at least explain your choices and apologize if need to
be rather than being defensive and insulting. This is
causing this long thread of emails that are
unproductive for everyone
And definitely, like any code changes, you need to
submit for approval or debate changes to the mailing
list or any other part of the project. Making decision
on your own is making yourself more a dictatorship
than a democratic type of project. Open source is
about working altogether and requires a bit more of
communication than just insulting and send bad
messages to the rest of the community.
Also this is were leader of a project should step in
rather than ignoring the issue and let this huge flame
was going on
We moved over the Rails list to google because it was pushing dozens of
gigabytes of traffic every day and the mailman load was bringing the
server it shared with the weblog, wiki, and other applications to its
knees.
In the process, we exported the list of members from the old list and
imported them here. That unfortunately meant that people with digest
settings got subscribed with per-email. We're sorry about that. It
should be quick and easy to change. As should it be to unsubscribe if
you don't want to be on the list at all.
that's not the biggest issue. the biggest issue is that the old subject
headers were dropped and everyone's filters were broken.
consider: i get about 1500 emails per day. broken filters mean a spammed a
inbox. i happen to be in the middle of a panic situation at work and am
conversing with my boss in thailand - to my suprise his messages came in
between hundreds of rails messages. it's fixed now, but i had to do it by
hand.
it would be great if you guys added the old subject headers in rather than
asking 100,000 people to reconfigure their clients. imho.
I don t think the problem is moving the mailing list..
The problem is about moving it without disussing it in
the community. A successful(and I am not saying ROR is
not) project knows that community is important and
needs to be involved in some of the changes you make.
You cannot just make the change and expect (Specially
for mailing list that really involves the community)
no reaction or everyone to be happy. Some people might
have given feedback prior to the move.
It is easy techincally to fix this for anyone but that
is the issue here. The issue is about leader stepping
in at the right time with the right word and keep the
project considering people opinion on this kind of
change or at least warn then...
It's not the end of the world but it was sloppy, inconsiderate, and
These two statements are true.
LAME AS FUCK. Whoever did it ought to be slapped.
This is not.
The way you do it is
this: You post the migration instructions on the list, many many
times. That way anybody who cares sees it and follows the instructions
Not necessarily. I have been through other list migrations before.
Some have been using the instructions that you've indicated, others
have been through automatic migration (although keeping the user's
mail preferences if at all possible). The *only* mistake made in this
migration was that there was no mention of it until it was already
done.
That's it.
-- and nobody else gets inconvenienced or SPAMMED.
I don't think that these words mean quite what you think they mean.
Especially the last. (It's not spam. You *did* subscribe to the other
list. It is therefore sensible to assume that you wanted to be
included in the migration since the old list was going away. In no way
can this change be considered spam, and anyone who thinks otherwise --
or reports abuse -- is simply being a moronic twit.)
Honestly, I think an apology is in order.
Yes. We're waiting for that, Mr Bowkett. From you and the others who
have acted like children since the list migration.
How are you getting spammed? If you were subscribed before, you got
the e-mails anyhow. You WERE subscribed before weren't you? Unless
somehow Mailman decided to go rogue and find your e-mail somewhere
else.
Is ONE DAY of non-digest subscription going to bring your machine to its knees?
I don't think anyone should apologize for the way it was handled; you
know if they took your approach, many people would miss it and then
those people would whine about it and say "WHY ARNT I GETING MSGS
ANYMORE!? PLZ HELP!!!?? KLOLTHXBYE!!" This was obviously the most
convenient and intelligent way to accomplish this, though I do wish
they had mentioned something at least on the blog so I could have been
aware of it beforehand (the initial e-mail was a bit unexpected and
made me suspicious).
what will happen if I send you an email with "[Rails]" in the
subject? I do know nothing about google-mail - I run a mailserver
by my own - but I think its a very bad idea to filter mails from
lists by inspection the subject.
That’s how I filter on every other mailing list I use and never had any problems. I’ve never had an email from anyone saying [Rails] in the subject. What would be a better way of filtering in your experience? Currently am filtering on the reply-to address on the new Rails list.
As already said I do not know how gmail filters work, but the most
preferable way to filter mails from mailing-lists is look at
the "Mailing-List" entry in the mail header:
X-Google-Loop: groups
Mailing-List: list rubyonrails-talk@googlegroups.com;
contact rubyonrails-talk-owner@googlegroups.com
List-Id: <rubyonrails-talk.googlegroups.com>
List-Post: <mailto:rubyonrails-talk@googlegroups.com>
List-Help: <mailto:rubyonrails-talk-help@googlegroups.com>
List-Unsubscribe:
<http://googlegroups.com/group/rubyonrails-talk/subscribe>,
<mailto:rubyonrails-talk-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at mail.wlanhacking.de
I use kmail and some webbased email clients and it just works fine
for me.
> what will happen if I send you an email with "[Rails]" in the
> subject? I do know nothing about google-mail - I run a mailserver
> by my own - but I think its a very bad idea to filter mails from
> lists by inspection the subject.
>
>
> Can you give me a hint?
That's how I filter on every other mailing list I use and never had
any problems. I've never had an email from anyone saying [Rails] in
the subject. What would be a better way of filtering in your
experience? Currently am filtering on the reply-to address on the new
Rails list.
That works, or you can just filter on the the "to" address for gmail.
I don't think gmail has options for filtering on a specific header
field, only to/from/body/etc.
Regardless, there should be no reason anyone with gmail has a problem
- just create a new filter or modify the current one to have the old
rails address, and the new google address in the to: line.